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Re: [dinosaur] "Yunyangosaurus" is not available
Good question. Personally I'd prefer the online publication date to
establish priority - if it's the complete and final version of a
publication. More broadly, the ICZN has to adapt to the digital age,
and realize that many (most?) readers never actually see the actual
printed copy of a journal - assuming there is a printed copy. As
we've established, for some journals there is no hard copy - they are
wholly digital.
Digital or electronic version is now the norm for scholarly journals,
and the ICZN seems to be stuck in the last century. We certainly have
to be wary of on-line "publishing" by rogue taxonomists as a way of
bypassing peer review. Unfortunately, the ICZN has a history of being
tolerant of rogue taxonomists who publish in self-published printed
'journals', so I'd say the ICZN needs to be more pro-active in this
regard across all media. For on-line journals, having an ISSN might
be a good place to start.
On Sat, Jan 25, 2020 at 7:07 AM Mickey Mortimer
<mickey_mortimer111@msn.com> wrote:
>
> How about taxa that were described "in legitimate journals (with an ISSN),
> with the best of intentions" but without a ZooBank reference, but which will
> eventually be published on paper, like Thanos? Are we going to recognize
> their online publication date (2018 in this case), or are we going to treat
> their publication date as their paper publication date (2020 probably in this
> case)? It could have important ramifications for synonymy and such...
>
> Mickey
>
> ________________________________
> From: dinosaur-l-request@usc.edu <dinosaur-l-request@usc.edu> on behalf of
> Thomas Richard Holtz <tholtz@umd.edu>
> Sent: Friday, January 24, 2020 4:32 AM
> To: Mike Taylor <sauropoda@gmail.com>
> Cc: Tim Williams <tijawi@gmail.com>; DML <dinosaur-l@usc.edu>
> Subject: Re: [dinosaur] "Yunyangosaurus" is not available
>
> Yes, agreed.
>
> On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 4:20 AM Mike Taylor <sauropoda@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I agree entirely. Zoological nomenclature is supposed to serve the
> community, not vice versa.
>
> -- Mike.
>
> On Fri, 24 Jan 2020 at 06:13, Tim Williams <tijawi@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > I know there is going to be a lot of people who disagree with me on
> > this, but... I'm not certain it's useful to declare a whole swathe of
> > dinosaur genera as nomina nuda, simply because they fall afoul of some
> > technicality in the ICZN Code (Article 8.5.3). Instead, a pragmatic
> > 'community standard' can be applied here. If workers in the field
> > continue to treat these names as valid, then for all intents and
> > purposes they are valid. All were published in legitimate journals
> > (with an ISSN), with the best of intentions - there is no hint of
> > malfeasance. So until this nomenclatural issue is rectified or
> > resolved, I think the best course of action is to continue to treat
> > these digitally published names as available. There's no need to
> > throw the baby out with the bathwater.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 4:35 PM Tyler Greenfield
> > <tgreenfield999@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Jim Kirkland has pointed out on Twitter that Geology of the Intermountain
> > > West seems to be in the same situation. This would mean that
> > > Maraapunisaurus and Dryosaurus elderae are nomina nuda as well.
> > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_Paleojim_status_1220573427188191232&d=DwIFaQ&c=clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN0H8p7CSfnc_gI&r=Ry_mO4IFaUmGof_Yl9MyZgecRCKHn5g4z1CYJgFW9SI&m=7ttzoy3StzASf7ytO6xXwHAU_FW9kDGUZvaUjD-_l9Y&s=5XxcN1ImSTYA6zC2Bk97tDuE69ZKAp5FRzX7_zmGwMI&e=
> > >
> > > On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 1:31 PM David Marjanovic
> > > <david.marjanovic@gmx.at> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Gesendet: Dienstag, 21. Januar 2020 um 17:24 Uhr
> > >> Von: "Mickey Mortimer" <mickey_mortimer111@msn.com>
> > >> Betreff: [dinosaur] Validity of "Yunyangosaurus" / is Scientific Reports
> > >> published physically?
> > >>
> > >> > Hi all. While writing the "Yunyangosaurus" entry for The Theropod
> > >> > Database, I noticed Dai et al.'s (2020) paper describing it has no
> > >> > mention of ZooBank. ICZN Article 8.5.3. states names published
> > >> > electronically must "be registered in the Official Register of
> > >> > Zoological Nomenclature (ZooBank) (see Article 78.2.4) and contain
> > >> > evidence in the work itself that such registration has occurred." So
> > >> > this obviously fails, and the name doesn't show up in ZooBank either.
> > >> > Normally that solves itself eventually by the physical publication of
> > >> > the journal volume, but "Yunyangosaurus" was described in Scientific
> > >> > Reports. As far as I can tell, Scientific Reports has no actual
> > >> > volumes, just a huge list of articles every year, which would suggest
> > >> > it is not physically published. Is this so? And if so, doesn't that
> > >> > indicate that Dai et al. 2020 will never be valid under the ICZN and
> > >> > that something else needs to be done by the authors to fix this?
> > >>
> > >> According to its website, Scientific Reports has an online ISSN, but a
> > >> paper ISSN is nowhere mentioned. This means that, as expected, it is
> > >> published exclusively online, and that the name "Yunyangosaurus" is not
> > >> available from the publication by Dai et al. (2020) or any other that
> > >> yet exists.
> > >>
> > >> "Not available" means the ICZN doesn't recognize it as even existing. It
> > >> does not compete for synonymy or homonymy.
> > >>
> > >> So, the ethical thing to do is to alert the authors that they need to
> > >> publish a whole new paper. In that paper, they can say "Diagnosis: see
> > >> Dai et al. (2020)", so the paper can be quite short, but it needs to be
> > >> a whole new publication.
>
>
>
> --
>
> Thomas R. Holtz, Jr.
> Email: tholtz@umd.edu Phone: 301-405-4084
> Principal Lecturer, Vertebrate Paleontology
>
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>
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>
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