Re: Trogons and Grebes

[Tim Williams <twilliams_alpha@hotmail.com>]

David Marjanovic wrote:

> What about *Juncitarsus*, as proposed by Mayr?

Nothing definitive.  Sangster (2005): "Relationships of Mirandornithes with 
other birds are as yet unresolved.  Mayr (2004) suggested that _Juncitarsus_ 
is most likely the sister-taxon of Mirandornithes because it shares some, 
but lacks other, synapomorphies of this clade."

> > If _Neogaeornis_ and _Polarornis_ (both foot-propelled diving birds fro 
> the LK) are indeed divers > (loons), then the Gaviidae is a very ancient 
> group.
>
> As reported, even molecular divergence date estimates say they're too old 
> for that. :-)

We have crown-group anseriforms in the Late Cretaceous, why not grebes and 
loons?

Cheers

Tim