Re: Coelurosauria Cladogram is here!

["Mickey Mortimer" <Mickey_Mortimer11@msn.com>]

Ken Kinman wrote-

>       Super cool cladogram (I obviously always take your analyses very
> seriously, although I would never base a classification solely on an
> analysis that omits flight characters).

Thanks.  I'm glad you like it, but again I must emphasize my matrix needs
some serious work, which is in process.  Forty-one characters done, 306 to
go....  I would agree on the flight-related part of your statement,
especially considering that in what way many of these characters relate to
flight is poorly understood, as is the probability of reversals once a taxon
is flightless.

>       The Alvarezsaurid-Avimid relationship doesn't surprise me, but being
> that close to Ornithomimes is a little surprising.

Both Martin and Sereno thought of the latter.

And that paraphyletic
> Caudipteridae makes me very happy.  I assume Nomingia is at the base of
the
> Oviraptorosauria sensu stricto (if so, that makes me even happier).

No, it's the sister to Microvenator + Oviraptorosauria sensu stricto.  I
left it out because it wasn't in Grant's tree.

>       Mickey, I'm wondering if the twisted-thumb character is part of your
> matrix??  Especially wondering if it is absent in all therizinosaurians
(or
> just segnosaurs).   Don't worry Jaime, I'm not planning on throwing them
out
> of Theropoda based on just a twisted thumb.  But it might add to their
> distinctiveness as a separate clade from oviraptorosaurs.

I would need some good definition of a "twisted thumb".  It sounds like it
would involve the distal condyles of metacarpal I being twisted compared to
the lateromedial axis of the metacarpus.  Such a character would be hard to
examine in many taxa.  I really don't see a difference between Alxasaurus,
Therizinosaurus and Elmisaurus though.  What is the difference you see?

Mickey Mortimer